3.13.2011

Tyranids in My Future... What's Up With That?

Okay, I'm stepping on myself a bit with this post, but I need some direction.  As I mentioned last night, we're doing a build project in our local area again, meaning all of us are starting or (picking up again from scratch, in some cases) new armies.  Last time we did this it was random, and I rolled Daemons - this time it's a personal choice.

Here's my acquisition - bagged up like drugs!



I picked the Bugs.  So am I a sucker for punishment?  Here's the current direction I'm considering.

I've got another variation replacing the Tyrannofexes with Carnifexes with Venon Cannons and adding a another Harpy, but this represents more the current direction of my thinking, hugely aided by Evil Homer and Farseer Tim.

This deviates significantly from where their Theory Hammer was taking them, but some of the thinking is borrowed (read that as 'lifted' or 'stolen') whole cloth.

I do that - especially with Evil Homer.  It's why it sucks he's leaving.  He's heading to Austin in 3-months and will no doubt contribute enormously to the community there.  He's a shark, guys; don't say I didn't warn you.

Moving on, here are some bullet points to consider:


  • The Elites choice is stacked with great options, but considering anti-mech is all-important, too often the choice is only how are you going to split the 3 spots among Zoanthropes and Hive Guard?
  • It's for that reason one must go outside the Elites to supplement non-close assault anti-tank... something big to shoot!  Enter the Tyrannofex with its poor man's bioform Rail Gun.
  • The expense sucks but if you're taking one you'd better take two.
  • Zoanthropes may be best for the remaining slot, but Deathleaper isn't bad - his ability is useful to reduce the Leadership of enemy Psychics.
  • The Tyranid Prime is Farseer Tim's contribution entirely: cheap and screenable.  The Swarmlord is popular, and I almost when there, but on consideration certain choices dictate a build... this monster is for outflanking Genestealers; moving on.
  • The troops are to bulk the numbers; there has to be at least the feeling of a horde, because Grey Knights have utterly killed pure Monstrous Creature builds.  Believe it.
  • The Harpies and 3-critter Carnifex Brood are my innovation.  The first provides a number of resources I'll find useful, while the latter provides an anchor to shove down the pipe.  It remains to be seen whether these considerations improve upon what's already out there.
  • I'm keeping the Brood of 'Fexes lean, other than the Furious Charge Upgrade.  I think its 15 Str10 attacks on the charge, assuming no attrition, with the ability to reroll all misses thanks to multiple Talons. Despite it all, I don't expect this Brood to survive a game; it's not meant to.


That's my current thinking; I welcome all input, and I have no doubt my nascent beliefs will change when the models hit the table!

20 comments:

Anonymous said...

I just got started in Nids and you should consider adding devourers to your Termagaunts so they actually can threaten something with shooting. I would also consider having two squads of Gaunts and one Hormagaunts because if your Tervigon poops out immediately you aren't stuck light on Gaunts.

Everything else seems standard for most lists I have seen which I don't really like personally. I am playing Drop Nids mainly because I am not a fan of traditional Nids builds. That is me though.

Anonymous said...

I'm a long time Nid player (9 years), so I'll give you what input I can.

I would go with podding Zoans over the DL. The Leaper is cool, but the potential damage output is way higher with the zoans, and I find they are excellent for getting armour that opponents are trying to hide like Vindi's and Preads. And that's not mentioning the horrible things they do to LR's most of the time.

I would run toxin stealers over horms, point by point they're the best anti-marine troop option Nids have. I can't explain how disappointing charging a tac squad in the open with horms and doing no wounds is.

As for your big CC fex brood. I run a 2 model brood of dakkafex's with attached prime and ruin everything. The prime is good for wound allocation shenanigans, and forward synapse. 24 TLed str6 shots a turn is great both for light vehicle suppression and putting lighting up tough squads. As you mentioned GK have put the hurt on MC builds and lots of other armies have ways to tie up your expensive brood.

Hope this helps, good luck, and welcome the to Hive.

Steven Morrow said...

Talon fex is a brute of a freight train

Brent said...

These are the kind of comments I was hoping for - I have insight but no experience, and in my mind experience trumps insight every time!

Anon-1: Is it standard? I get the Elites section, but I've yet to see Harpies on the table. I get where you're coming from though - and I'll certainly look at the Devourers.

Anon-2: That's an awesome idea! Obviously I was planning on sticking the Prime with the Shrieker Killers, but your squad seems brutal in all the turns of the game.

My thinking was to avoid the temptation to shoot and concentrate on running - I'll be sure to try out your suggestion too.

Steve: That's what I'm hoping for!

GMort. said...

Zoanthropes land, maybe kill something and then die which is why I no longer use them and I'm happy to see you didn't bother with them yourself.

You may find the following interesting,

http://gmortschaotica.blogspot.com/2010/07/mathshammer-zoanthropes-vs-tyrannofex.html

Deathleaper is nice for the anti-psyker effect but at high points values you'll be wishing you had the additional medium anti-tank provided by a 3rd unit of Hive Guard.
Remember to give the Tyrannofex's the 'Cluster Spine' and 'Larvae' upgrades. I only mention it because they're no-brainer free upgrades not mentioned in the army list you posted.

If you'd like to avoid some of the elementary mistakes made by me then some of the earlier posts in the following series of articles may be useful

http://gmortschaotica.blogspot.com/search/label/Tyranid%20Project

Nuclear said...

You should look into raveners over the harmagants. Ravs give you a very fast unit that hits really hard, but I'm sure you know that, playing fiends. The hormagants are just gonna be cannon fodder and tar pits, which gants with tervigon upgrades can do well.

Evil Homer said...

furious charge not worth it on fexes. No book in front of me but I think it takes them from 2 to 3 so even with....guard and sisters? If it takes your I to 4 then disregard this comment...

GMort. said...

The 'Living Battering Ram' rule adds +2 to the Carnifex's Initiative on the charge. Combined with 'Furious Charge' this would make the Fex Initiative 4.

Evil Homer said...

and therein lies the danger of posting without the codex handy. Being out of town away from books will do that to you.

Ghostin said...

Hey Brent - I started 'nids a few months ago and have been compiling articles I find most useful in my "Library" series; Gmorts' articles are heavily represented =)

http://midlifegamingcrisis.blogspot.com/

Why 2500 points?

Brent said...

Ghostin: Because the idea is to build toward using the army in this year's Hard Boyz! Thanks for the link mate - I'll get over that way today. :)

GMort: Same to you, sir - I'll be sure to check out the articles. Re: the upgrades, I just forgot to click the boxes before I duplicated, I think.

You're probably right re: Deathleaper; I'll probably try it both ways.

Evil Homer: :) Method to the madness! Like GMort said, plus in subsequent rounds I'll go before Power Fists and Thunder Hammers.

Also, Str. 10 is a significant difference against Land Raiders - that is, needing a 1/3 chance to penetrate Vs a 1/6 (on the charge, of course).

Thanks to everyone who took the time to comment!

AdamHarry said...

Hey Brent, AdamHarry here from BoLS. Just wanted to wish you luck with your 'nids! I'll be keeping an eye on your progress to see how you fare with them! I've put mine on the work bench for now, painting up more Trigons but I would like to echo what the other posters said about the dakka fexes. Don't forget, on the charge it's (a dakkafex) still going to have 5 attacks at STR 1 million. It's pretty impressive and a lot of fun to play around with.

Black Blow Fly said...

I like the Swarmlord deathstar unit:

Swarmy
3x Tyrant Guard w. lash whips
Prime w. dual bone swords & regen + adrenal glands

It is the sickness .

G

Brent said...

AdamHarry: Dude, of course I know who you are - you're the holder of the best name... EVER. Your bat reps are getting better and better - and I liked 'em before!

Are you going to Adepticon in the party bus or what?

BBF: Awesome idea - I'd not seen that one!

It sounds like I've got a lot of playing around to do, but I'm looking forward to this in a big way.

The_King_Elessar said...

Quite close to my eventual plans for the TyranOrks. Main difference is that I took no Horms, 2 min Gaunt broods, 2 T-Gons, 3 Ravs and a few Spore mines...a unit of Gargs too. Sadly, haven't tested, but my experience of fighting Nids shows me that Gargs are too threatening to ignore when they get close, and combined with another unit threatening anything on foot, irksome. Admittedly, Tau can't exactly move away from these things, and have to rely on shooting...

rendsma: The act of rolling a 6 to wound your mother.

Purgatus said...

Hey Brent! Welcome to Nids brother. I hope you enjoy them. I'm still in the nascent phases myself though I'm probably a bit further down the road at this point (though going slow, please pass on the left ;)

One thing you said jumped out at me:

"Also, Str. 10 is a significant difference against Land Raiders - that is, needing a 1/3 chance to penetrate Vs a 1/6 (on the charge, of course)."

Remember that a Carnifex is a Monstrous Creature and so rolls 2D6 to Penetrate Vehicles. Thus at Strength 9 the Carnifex penetrates 72.2% of the time and at Strength 10 penetrates 83.3% of the time. Just something to keep in the back of your noggin.

Brent said...

OMG!

How did I miss that?!?

That's a seriously obvious mistake - I've been known to crack Raiders with Daemon Princes... Strength 5 and all that.

It's one of those rules I know but didn't carry over to the new army.

Thanks Purgatus! I didn't see what was staring me in the face. :)

OverCaffeinated said...

Hey Brent, I'm looking forward to seeing how you progress with your 'nids. Everyone said Daemons couldn't be competitive and you proved them wrong, and I have no doubt you'll do it with the nids too.

Robert said...

I have tried running Hormagaunts with only toxin sacks or only adrenal glands...and every time I found myself in situations where I wished I had the other. Recently I have been purchasing both upgrades for my hormogaunt, but have to run them in smaller numbers (in part because I don't own as many). That said, I think adrenal glands are slightly more useful because it allows you to drag down tanks if you have to.

I do think you would like raveners, as you can use them more or less like you would use fiends of slanesh. I haven't used harpies so I don't have a basis for comparison, but raveners are probably the unit most hated by my friends.

hyv3mynd said...

Hey Brent~

I reviewed your list as requested. Welcome to the hive!

http://synaps3.blogspot.com/2011/03/strictly-awesome.html

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